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+- I just thought of [[suffering]].
+  - Think of the suffering of the beings that die to feed others: some of that suffering is justified inasmuch it enables other conscious beings to subsist.
+  - When it is kept to a minimum, of course, we seem to arrive at the ethical optimum. But there are plenty of tradeoffs potentially worth taking.
+  - Think of worms getting grown and harvested for feed, but also of the beautiful bird hunted by the cat and the fish who die in the nets of [[fisherpeople]].